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	<title>Comments on: Boiling The Water</title>
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		<title>By: Week Six On Patriots Daily : Patriots Daily</title>
		<link>http://www.patriotsdaily.com/2008/10/boiling-the-water/comment-page-1/#comment-5324</link>
		<dc:creator>Week Six On Patriots Daily : Patriots Daily</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Feb 2009 14:44:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.patriotsdaily.com/?p=1227#comment-5324</guid>
		<description>[...] Benson was coming to a boil by [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Benson was coming to a boil by [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Buckin’ The Urge to Panic : Patriots Daily</title>
		<link>http://www.patriotsdaily.com/2008/10/boiling-the-water/comment-page-1/#comment-4356</link>
		<dc:creator>Buckin’ The Urge to Panic : Patriots Daily</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Oct 2008 10:53:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.patriotsdaily.com/?p=1227#comment-4356</guid>
		<description>[...] Scott pointed out in Tuesday&#8217;s Just Slingin&#8217; It, the Broncos are awful on the defensive side of the ball; even worse than the Pats in almost all [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Scott pointed out in Tuesday&#8217;s Just Slingin&#8217; It, the Broncos are awful on the defensive side of the ball; even worse than the Pats in almost all [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Quicksand Cassel : Patriots Daily</title>
		<link>http://www.patriotsdaily.com/2008/10/boiling-the-water/comment-page-1/#comment-4334</link>
		<dc:creator>Quicksand Cassel : Patriots Daily</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Oct 2008 11:02:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.patriotsdaily.com/?p=1227#comment-4334</guid>
		<description>[...] our eyes tell us, and as the stats back up, the Patriots just aren&#8217;t a very good team. We suspected as much [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] our eyes tell us, and as the stats back up, the Patriots just aren&#8217;t a very good team. We suspected as much [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.patriotsdaily.com/2008/10/boiling-the-water/comment-page-1/#comment-4321</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 21:57:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.patriotsdaily.com/?p=1227#comment-4321</guid>
		<description>Beaker, I think you hit it - at first blush, it may seem like blind loyalty to the veterans, but its really that they think the smarter, more experienced guy is always going to be better than the young guy even if the young guy can jump over buildings and the vet gets older every day. That worked for them to great effect for a long time, but its hard to see how its working for them now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Beaker, I think you hit it &#8211; at first blush, it may seem like blind loyalty to the veterans, but its really that they think the smarter, more experienced guy is always going to be better than the young guy even if the young guy can jump over buildings and the vet gets older every day. That worked for them to great effect for a long time, but its hard to see how its working for them now.</p>
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		<title>By: Britt Schramm</title>
		<link>http://www.patriotsdaily.com/2008/10/boiling-the-water/comment-page-1/#comment-4320</link>
		<dc:creator>Britt Schramm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 21:39:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.patriotsdaily.com/?p=1227#comment-4320</guid>
		<description>Scott - great points (and thanks for taking all of my wonderful stats for the Broncs).  I think that there was only one person who had any fire in his belly and that was Josh McDaniels at the end of the half; jawing into Belichick&#039;s ear.  

Is it me or does Pees look like a stand-in for Belichick?  There are no wrinkles from week to week (I&#039;m sorry but a four man front line is not a wrinkle), no mid-game or halftime adjustments, no friggin&#039; ballhawking.  The players are no longer adaptable; no longer multi-purpose.  They play their role and that&#039;s it.  

At some point, the inlfux of new blood needs to take place; even at the expense of their record.  Especially when you consider that Brady will only be behind center for not much longer than 5 years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Scott &#8211; great points (and thanks for taking all of my wonderful stats for the Broncs).  I think that there was only one person who had any fire in his belly and that was Josh McDaniels at the end of the half; jawing into Belichick&#8217;s ear.  </p>
<p>Is it me or does Pees look like a stand-in for Belichick?  There are no wrinkles from week to week (I&#8217;m sorry but a four man front line is not a wrinkle), no mid-game or halftime adjustments, no friggin&#8217; ballhawking.  The players are no longer adaptable; no longer multi-purpose.  They play their role and that&#8217;s it.  </p>
<p>At some point, the inlfux of new blood needs to take place; even at the expense of their record.  Especially when you consider that Brady will only be behind center for not much longer than 5 years.</p>
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		<title>By: Tony</title>
		<link>http://www.patriotsdaily.com/2008/10/boiling-the-water/comment-page-1/#comment-4319</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 21:12:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.patriotsdaily.com/?p=1227#comment-4319</guid>
		<description>Lost in all of the hype surrounding the 16-0 regular season and the pyrotechnics on offense in 2007 was the simple fact that the Pats were ranked a mediocre 11th in the NFL&#039;s defensive passer rating category, and that was with Asante Samuel starting at corner, and with Mike Vrabel posting his career high in sacks. In the Super Bowl, the pass defense folded up like a lawn chair in the 4th quarter, allowing two TD drives of 80+ yards to blow the perfect season.

In 2008, Samuel is gone and Vrabel&#039;s name has hardly been called at all in the first five games (is he hurt, or has he pulled a &quot;Jim Rice, 1987&quot;, career-falls-off-the-cliff maneuver in just 8 months since the Super Bowl?)

The defensive lineman are still effective against the run, but really, other than Seymour in his absolute prime, how many of the three starters ever generated much pressure on the QB in their careers? It&#039;s not their job to do that--Jarvis Green was actually their best pass rusher on the line during the glory years, not any of the three starters. 

It&#039;s the job of the LBs to get pressure on the QB, and they&#039;re simply not doing it.

I don&#039;t know why Adalius Thomas hasn&#039;t been very productive with the Pats. Maybe the fact that they signed him as he was turning 30 (that&#039;s old for a football player, even in today&#039;s game) has something to do with it.

The fact that BB and Pioli completely ignored the Front 7 in three consecutive drafts after lucking into Wilfork at #21 in 2004 has more to do with this decline than anything else. I still don&#039;t know what they were thinking when they went whole-hog after offensive players in the 2006 draft, including TWO tight ends(!), when they clearly had issues in the secondary and at linebacker.

I believe Scott nailed it: the problem is that the defensive philosophy that won them championships in the earlier part of this decade is either no longer working because other teams have gameplanned for it, or they simply need to inject younger talent into the key positions that are still being clogged up by the old warhorses like Bruschi, Vrabel and Harrison.

I also think that Pees could be part of the problem. Since he took over the D in 2006, upon Mangini&#039;s departure, there have been more receivers running free through the middle of the Pats&#039; defense than I can ever remember, even in the bad old days of Rod Rust. They also haven&#039;t tackled very well in the last few years--that&#039;s coaching. That requires the defensive coordinator to put the fear of God into any defender who whiffs on a big tackle during the game. Romeo Crennel would do that; I&#039;m not sure that Pees has it in him.

But all of that said, I still have confidence that they can turn this thing around quickly in 2009. Losing 7 or more games this season will lead to higher draft picks next April, and they&#039;ll also probably be given an extra 3rd rounder as compensation for losing Samuel--so the tools will be there to reload right away. If they go into free agency again, I&#039;d like to see them stay away from the 30-somethings and actually sign somebody young enough to be as productive as Thomas was BEFORE he came to New England and instantly got old.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lost in all of the hype surrounding the 16-0 regular season and the pyrotechnics on offense in 2007 was the simple fact that the Pats were ranked a mediocre 11th in the NFL&#8217;s defensive passer rating category, and that was with Asante Samuel starting at corner, and with Mike Vrabel posting his career high in sacks. In the Super Bowl, the pass defense folded up like a lawn chair in the 4th quarter, allowing two TD drives of 80+ yards to blow the perfect season.</p>
<p>In 2008, Samuel is gone and Vrabel&#8217;s name has hardly been called at all in the first five games (is he hurt, or has he pulled a &#8220;Jim Rice, 1987&#8243;, career-falls-off-the-cliff maneuver in just 8 months since the Super Bowl?)</p>
<p>The defensive lineman are still effective against the run, but really, other than Seymour in his absolute prime, how many of the three starters ever generated much pressure on the QB in their careers? It&#8217;s not their job to do that&#8211;Jarvis Green was actually their best pass rusher on the line during the glory years, not any of the three starters. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s the job of the LBs to get pressure on the QB, and they&#8217;re simply not doing it.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know why Adalius Thomas hasn&#8217;t been very productive with the Pats. Maybe the fact that they signed him as he was turning 30 (that&#8217;s old for a football player, even in today&#8217;s game) has something to do with it.</p>
<p>The fact that BB and Pioli completely ignored the Front 7 in three consecutive drafts after lucking into Wilfork at #21 in 2004 has more to do with this decline than anything else. I still don&#8217;t know what they were thinking when they went whole-hog after offensive players in the 2006 draft, including TWO tight ends(!), when they clearly had issues in the secondary and at linebacker.</p>
<p>I believe Scott nailed it: the problem is that the defensive philosophy that won them championships in the earlier part of this decade is either no longer working because other teams have gameplanned for it, or they simply need to inject younger talent into the key positions that are still being clogged up by the old warhorses like Bruschi, Vrabel and Harrison.</p>
<p>I also think that Pees could be part of the problem. Since he took over the D in 2006, upon Mangini&#8217;s departure, there have been more receivers running free through the middle of the Pats&#8217; defense than I can ever remember, even in the bad old days of Rod Rust. They also haven&#8217;t tackled very well in the last few years&#8211;that&#8217;s coaching. That requires the defensive coordinator to put the fear of God into any defender who whiffs on a big tackle during the game. Romeo Crennel would do that; I&#8217;m not sure that Pees has it in him.</p>
<p>But all of that said, I still have confidence that they can turn this thing around quickly in 2009. Losing 7 or more games this season will lead to higher draft picks next April, and they&#8217;ll also probably be given an extra 3rd rounder as compensation for losing Samuel&#8211;so the tools will be there to reload right away. If they go into free agency again, I&#8217;d like to see them stay away from the 30-somethings and actually sign somebody young enough to be as productive as Thomas was BEFORE he came to New England and instantly got old.</p>
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		<title>By: Beaker</title>
		<link>http://www.patriotsdaily.com/2008/10/boiling-the-water/comment-page-1/#comment-4317</link>
		<dc:creator>Beaker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 20:38:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.patriotsdaily.com/?p=1227#comment-4317</guid>
		<description>If BB is the bloodless automaton that he is made out to be, then he would have no problem getting rid of these guys at the first sign of aging. Does he put more value in knowing the system even if it comes at the expense of a player having lost several steps? Also, as you mentioned Scott, how does that explain bringing a guy in his prime like Thomas on board and then trying to turn him into something he&#039;s not?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If BB is the bloodless automaton that he is made out to be, then he would have no problem getting rid of these guys at the first sign of aging. Does he put more value in knowing the system even if it comes at the expense of a player having lost several steps? Also, as you mentioned Scott, how does that explain bringing a guy in his prime like Thomas on board and then trying to turn him into something he&#8217;s not?</p>
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.patriotsdaily.com/2008/10/boiling-the-water/comment-page-1/#comment-4316</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 19:51:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.patriotsdaily.com/?p=1227#comment-4316</guid>
		<description>John, Richard Seymour was a first round pick in 2001. That&#039;s EIGHT years ago. Warren was 02; seven years ago. A lot of water under the bridge since then. Where they were drafted is not really relevant to what&#039;s happening now. 

I&#039;d suggest you&#039;re not seeing them for what they are as players in the here and now. No comparison between them and the Colts in terms of talent? You&#039;d be right if this was 2004. In 2008, I&#039;d say that&#039;s actually a good comparison. 

The names Bruschi and Vrabel and Harrison still carry a lot of weight in our hearts and minds for what they did five years ago. They don&#039;t carry a whole lot of weight on the field today, though. That couldn&#039;t be any more obvious. Watch Vrabel try to come off the edge on a passing down now, and tell me if his problem is motivation, or of he&#039;s 60% of the player he was when they were winning championships.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John, Richard Seymour was a first round pick in 2001. That&#8217;s EIGHT years ago. Warren was 02; seven years ago. A lot of water under the bridge since then. Where they were drafted is not really relevant to what&#8217;s happening now. </p>
<p>I&#8217;d suggest you&#8217;re not seeing them for what they are as players in the here and now. No comparison between them and the Colts in terms of talent? You&#8217;d be right if this was 2004. In 2008, I&#8217;d say that&#8217;s actually a good comparison. </p>
<p>The names Bruschi and Vrabel and Harrison still carry a lot of weight in our hearts and minds for what they did five years ago. They don&#8217;t carry a whole lot of weight on the field today, though. That couldn&#8217;t be any more obvious. Watch Vrabel try to come off the edge on a passing down now, and tell me if his problem is motivation, or of he&#8217;s 60% of the player he was when they were winning championships.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://www.patriotsdaily.com/2008/10/boiling-the-water/comment-page-1/#comment-4315</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 19:42:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.patriotsdaily.com/?p=1227#comment-4315</guid>
		<description>I think I&#039;m with DryHeave on most of these points but I&#039;d argue that the whole &#039;deflated&#039; thing is overplayed. DH, the D may feel deflated when an open pass is missed, but by the same token, I&#039;d be pretty deflated as an offensive player after watching the defense give up 95 yard drives when they had SD pinned against their own goal line. I agree that the 17-3 deficit looked pretty hopeless when Cassel couldn&#039;t get them in on First and Goal to start the second half, but the game sure as shit was over the minute the Chargers took it from there and scored. Maybe the game didn&#039;t have to be over if they&#039;d held SD to a 3 and out and force them to punt from their own end zone. My point is it goes both ways; there&#039;s been just as much dispiriting play by the defense as there has the offense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I&#8217;m with DryHeave on most of these points but I&#8217;d argue that the whole &#8216;deflated&#8217; thing is overplayed. DH, the D may feel deflated when an open pass is missed, but by the same token, I&#8217;d be pretty deflated as an offensive player after watching the defense give up 95 yard drives when they had SD pinned against their own goal line. I agree that the 17-3 deficit looked pretty hopeless when Cassel couldn&#8217;t get them in on First and Goal to start the second half, but the game sure as shit was over the minute the Chargers took it from there and scored. Maybe the game didn&#8217;t have to be over if they&#8217;d held SD to a 3 and out and force them to punt from their own end zone. My point is it goes both ways; there&#8217;s been just as much dispiriting play by the defense as there has the offense.</p>
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		<title>By: John</title>
		<link>http://www.patriotsdaily.com/2008/10/boiling-the-water/comment-page-1/#comment-4314</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 14 Oct 2008 19:38:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.patriotsdaily.com/?p=1227#comment-4314</guid>
		<description>Their defense front is all first round picks. They have a top rookie at linebacker, surrounded by Pro Bowl players. The secondary is mediocre. Why are they allowing 4.6 yard per carry? That is the same as the Colts and there is no comparison in regards to talent. Motivation, coaching, something is amiss.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Their defense front is all first round picks. They have a top rookie at linebacker, surrounded by Pro Bowl players. The secondary is mediocre. Why are they allowing 4.6 yard per carry? That is the same as the Colts and there is no comparison in regards to talent. Motivation, coaching, something is amiss.</p>
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